30 Jan Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 3, Chapter 19, Text 32
FOLLOWING IS A LECTURE ON THE SRIMAD BHAGAVATAM CANTO 3, CHAPTER 19, TEXT 32 GIVEN BY HIS HOLINESS BHAKTI CARU SWAM IN ISKCON UJJAIN, INDIA, ON 30 January 2010
Om namo bhagavate Vasudevaya
Om namo bhagavate Vasudevaya
Om namo bhagavate Vasudevaya
maya yathanuktam avadi te hareh
krtavatarasya sumitra cestitam
yatha hiranyaksa udara-vikramo
maha-mrdhe kridanavan nirakrtah
Maitreya continued: My dear Vidura, I have explained to you the Personality of Godhead’s coming down as the first boar incarnation and killing in a great fight a demon of unprecedented prowess as if he were just a plaything. This has been narrated by me as I heard it from my predecessor spiritual master.
Here the sage Maitreya admits that he explained the incident of the killing of Hiranyaksa by the Supreme Personality of Godhead as a straight narration; he did not manufacture anything or add interpretation, but explained whatever he had heard from his spiritual master. Thus he accepted as bona fide the system of parampara, or receiving the transcendental message in disciplic succession. Unless received by this bona fide process of hearing from a spiritual master, the statement of an acharya or preceptor cannot be valid.
It is also stated here that although the demon Hiranyaksa was unlimited in prowess, he was just like a doll for the Lord. A child breaks so many dolls without real endeavor. Similarly, although a demon may be very powerful and extraordinary in the eyes of an ordinary man in the material world, to the Lord, killing such a demon is no difficulty. He can kill millions of demons as simply as a child plays with dolls and breaks them.
So these last few chapters are actually describing Hiranyakasipu and Hiranayksa’s coming down to this material nature. From Who were Hiranyaksa and Hiranyakasipu ?
Audience: “Vijay and Jaya.”
Jaya became Hiranyakasipu and Vijay became Hiranayksa. They were cursed by The Four Kumaras that they will fall down to the material nature. It was actually the Lord’s arrangement. He wanted to fulfill the desire of Jaya and Vijaya to fight with Him. Now, in the spiritual sky they could not fight with the Lord therefore the arena for fight had to be arranged on this material nature. And as the result of that they had to come down to the material nature. So, what was the arrangement? The arrangement was that These Four Kumaras curse these two gate keepers. So they came to the material nature. In three Yugas, they came and became enemies of the Lord: Hiranyakasipu and Hiranyaksa in Satya Yuga; Ravana and Kumbakarna in Treta Yuga; and Sisupala and Dantavakra in Dvapara Yuga. They were very, very, very powerful personalities. Now, Hiranyksa was powerful, he was so powerful that he defeated everyone in the universe, except Lord Brahma. He defeated everybody. Brahma is his grandfather; therefore he did not challenge him. Hiranyakasipu and Hiranyaksa were the sons of Kasyapa. Kasyapa was the son of Kulaha and Kulaha was the son of Lord Brahma. Brahma had ten Manasaputras, the children who were born from his mind. So these personalities were extremely we can see they were very, very powerful personalities.
There are two types of people:
1. Those who are powerful, but who benefit the people in general and
2. Some powerful who actually misuse their power and cause harm to the living entities.
So, these Hiransyakasipu and Hiranyksa became very demoniac. They started to cause a lot of distress to the people. They were very cruel, they were very offensive to the saintly people and especially the demigods, and they were very envious of them. So they were actually the cousins of the demigods, not the cousins, the step brothers of the demigods. Kasyapa had many wives. One of his wives was Aditi and from Aditi came the demigods adityas. And from Diti came these two dityas, Diti’s sons, two sons, Hiranyakasipu and Hiranayksa. Yah I made a mistake not Kulaha was the father of Kasyapa but Kulasta was the father. Brahma had ten sons Kulaha, Kulasta, Kratu, Angira, Atri and the youngest was Narada. So these are Brahma’s manasaputras. These demigods were given charge of the universal affairs. All the affair of the universe is controlled by the demigods. There are different departments and there are different in charge of those departments.And who are those personalities? They are the suras or the demigods. Why they are suras? Because they are obedient to the Supreme Personality. When somebody becomes a devotee of the Lord, naturally Lord gives them some responsible position. Because He is The Supreme Personality of Godhead, He is the Supreme controller. Since He is The Supreme Controller, He actually gives important positions to His favorite individuals, His favorite devotees. Therefore devotee is always given the responsible position. Like in your house, who will you give the important position? Or if you have a business who will you appoint in important positions? Those, who are obedient to you, so, The Supreme Personality of Godhead is the Supreme Controller and those who are obedient to Him, He gives them responsible positions. But the demons consider why they have got the responsibility? Why not us? That was the consideration of Hiranyakasipu and Hiranyaksa. That, why we are coming from the same father, why our step brothers have their residence in the heavenly planets where they have so many facilities? And they are given the charge of important positions why not us? So attack them! That is the demoniac mentality. They do not consider that the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who is The Supreme Proprietor, He has the authority to appoint people in different positions. This way Hiranyakasipu and Hiranyaksa, these two brothers, started to create a lot of disturbances and Hiranyksa went and defeated many many very powerful individuals. The last person that he approached was Varuna, and asked him:
“Come and fight with me.” Varuna said: “Look, I am old, I am no match for you. You are very powerful so you won’t really get the joy that you want to derive by defeating me, so go and fight with somebody who is equal to you in power or more powerful than you, that by defeating him then you will derive the joy.
So, then Hiranyksa asked: “Who is that who is more powerful than me? Who is that who is the right match for me?”
He said: “There is somebody, His name is Hari.”
He asked: “Where is Hari?”
He said: “Hari is everywhere, but it is difficult to find Him. Although He is everywhere, it is difficult to find Him. But those who are fortunate, they can get to see Him. So you search for Him and if He wants, he may appear in front of you.”So then Hiranyksa, very proudly, stepped down looking for Hari. And then he saw that a boar was raising from below, a huge gigantic boar with the earth placed on His tusks. The boars have their tusks coming from the lower jaw; Elephants have their tusk from the upper jaw. But the boars have their tusks from the lower jaw. The earth was placed on His dasana-sikhare dharasa, dasana-means teeth;the earth planet was situated on the teeth, tusks of the boar;the earth actually fell on the lesser region, the lower region, and He raised the earth planet from the lower region. And Hiranyksa became very agitated, very angry, that “Who dears to lift the earth without my permission?” It is because of him that the earth actually fell into the lower region. So he was questioning, so he challenged. So Varahadeva, this boar was Varahadeva, He appeared in front of Hiranyksa, He placed the earth again to the orbit and then He accepted the challenge of Hiranyaksa. And they fought; they fought for a long time. Actually it was Lord’s pastimes; the Lord could kill him in no time. As this verse has been describing, kriranavan nirakatau , krirana or kriranak means a plaything, krira means play and krirana means a plaything, a toy. A child plays with a toy and the child can break the toy without any difficulty. So when He killed Hiranyksa, apparently the Lord was fighting, Hiranyaksaa was very powerful; but although Hiranyaksa was very powerful but the Lord was more powerful than anyone else. Compare to the Lord everyone is absolutely insignificant. No matter how powerful one may appear to be. So they fought, there is a long description of the fight.Should I read the description of the fight between Hiranyksa and the Lord? It starts before but I just start from this chapter only, the eighteen chapter.
Maitreya continued: The proud and falsely glorious Daitya paid little heed to the words of Varuna. O dear Vidura, he learned from Narada the whereabouts of the Supreme Personality of Godhead and hurriedly betook himself to the depths of the ocean.
He saw there the all-powerful Personality of Godhead in His boar incarnation, bearing the earth upward on the ends of His tusks and robbing him of his splendor with His reddish eyes. The demon laughed: Oh, an amphibious beast!
The demon addressed the Lord: O best of the demigods, dressed in the form of a boar, just hear me. This earth is entrusted to us, the inhabitants of the lower regions, and You cannot take it from my presence and not be hurt by me.
You rascal, You have been nourished by our enemies to kill us, and You have killed some demons by remaining invisible. O fool, Your power is only mystic, so today I shall enliven my kinsmen by killing You.
The demon continued: When You fall dead with Your skull smashed by the mace hurled by my arms, the demigods and sages who offer You oblations and sacrifice in devotional service will also automatically cease to exist, like trees without roots.
Actually it is a nice point here that Hiranyksa knew the situation of a devotee.
Devotee derives everything from the Supreme Personality of Godhead. For a devotee, the source of his existence is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So he knows that the demigods and sages they survive because of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So when I kill you they will also perish. But little did he know that the Supreme Personality of Godhead can never be killed. But here is one important thing for us to understand from Hiranyksa. Gold must be collected even from a dirty place. A good point made by a demon also must be taken into consideration. So, Hiranyksa is saying that for a devotee…”the demigods and sages who offer You oblations and sacrifice in devotional service will also automatically cease to exist” when the lord is killed. He said when I will kill you; they also will cease to exist. So what does that mean? A devotee exists only because of the Lord, for the sake of the lord. So what lesson do we learn here? Our entire life should be completely dedicated to the service of the lord and nothing else no other consideration. If we do that then our life will become successful. And whoever does that, his life becomes successful. Who does not do that his life goes to waste. So let us become good devotees.
The demon, who had golden hair on his head and fearful tusks, gave chase to the Lord while He was rising from the water, even as an alligator would chase an elephant. Roaring like thunder, he said: Are You not ashamed of running away before a challenging adversary? There is nothing reproachable for shameless creatures!
The Lord placed the earth within His sight on the surface of the water and transferred to her His own energy in the form of the ability to float on the water. While the enemy stood looking on, Brahm?, the creator of the universe, extolled the Lord, and the other demigods rained flowers on Him.
The demon, who had a wealth of ornaments, bangles and beautiful golden armor on his body, chased the Lord from behind with a great mace. The Lord tolerated his piercing ill words, but in order to reply to him, He expressed His terrible anger.
The Personality of Godhead said: Indeed, We are creatures of the jungle, and We are searching after hunting dogs like you. One who is freed from the entanglement of death has no fear from the loose talk in which you are indulging, for you are bound up by the laws of death.
In the material nature, no matter how powerful one is, he is bound by the laws of death.
Certainly We have stolen the charge of the inhabitants of Ras?tala and have lost all shame. Although bitten by your powerful mace, I shall stay here in the water for some time because, having created enmity with a powerful enemy, I now have no place to go.
You are supposed to be the commander of many foot soldiers, and now you may take prompt steps to overthrow Us. Give up all your foolish talk and wipe out the cares of your kith and kin by slaying Us. One may be proud, yet he does not deserve a seat in an assembly if he fails to fulfill his promised word.
This is how it started, he challenged the Lord
Hissing indignantly, all his senses shaken by wrath, the demon quickly sprang upon the Lord and dealt Him a blow with his powerful mace.
So Hiranyaksa with his powerful mass tried to hit the lord.
The Lord, however, by moving slightly aside, dodged the violent mace-blow aimed at His breast by the enemy, just as an accomplished yog? would elude death.
The Personality of Godhead now exhibited His anger and rushed to meet the demon, who bit his lip in rage, took up his mace again and began to repeatedly brandish it about.
Then with His mace the Lord struck the enemy on the right of his brow, but since the demon was expert in fighting, O gentle Vidura, he protected himself by a maneuver of his own mace.
In this way, the demon Hiranyksa and the Lord, the Personality of Godhead, struck each other with their huge maces, each enraged and seeking his own victory.
There was keen rivalry between the two combatants; both had sustained injuries on their bodies from the blows of each other’s pointed maces, and each grew more and more enraged at the smell of blood on his person. In their eagerness to win, they performed maneuvers of various kinds, and their contest looked like an encounter between two forceful bulls for the sake of a cow
Then Brahma appeared.
Lord Brahm? said: My dear Lord, this demon has proved to be a constant pinprick to the demigods, the brahmanas, the cows and innocent persons who are spotless and always dependent upon worshiping Your lotus feet. He has become a source of fear by unnecessarily harassing them. Since he has attained a boon from me, he has become a demon, always searching for a proper combatant, wandering all over the universe for this infamous purpose.
In this way Lord Brahma prayed to the Lord.
Sri Maitreya said: After hearing the words of Brahm?, the creator, which were free from all sinful purposes and as sweet as nectar, the Lord heartily laughed and accepted his prayer with a glance laden with love
The Lord, who had appeared from the nostril of Brahma, sprang and aimed His mace at the chin of His enemy, the Hiranyksa demon, who was stalking fearlessly before Him.
Struck by the demon’s mace, however, the Lord’s mace slipped from His hand and looked splendid as it fell down whirling. This was miraculous, for the mace was blazing wonderfully.
Even though the demon had an excellent opportunity to strike his unarmed foe without obstruction, he respected the law of single combat, thereby kindling the fury of the Supreme Lord.
As the Lord’s mace fell to the ground and a cry of alarm arose from the witnessing crowd of gods and rishis, the Personality of Godhead acknowledged the demon’s love of righteousness and therefore invoked His Sudarsana discus.
As the discus began to revolve in the Lord’s hands and the Lord contended at close quarters with the chief of His Vaikuntha attendants, who had been born as Hiranyksa, a vile son of Diti, there issued from every direction strange expressions uttered by those who were witnessing from airplanes. They had no knowledge of the Lord’s reality, and they cried, “May victory attend You! Pray dispatch him. Play no more with him.”
When the demon saw the Personality of Godhead, who had eyes just like lotus petals, standing in position before him, armed with His Sudarsana discus, his senses were overpowered by indignation. He began to hiss like a serpent, and he bit his lip in great resentment.
The demon, who had fearful tusks, stared at the Personality of Godhead as though to burn Him. Springing into the air, he aimed his mace at the Lord, exclaiming at the same time, “You are slain!”
O saintly Vidura, while His enemy looked on, the Lord in His boar form, the enjoyer of all sacrificial offerings, playfully knocked down the mace with His left foot, even as it came upon Him with the force of a tempest.
The Lord then said: “Take up your weapon and try again, eager as you are to conquer Me.” Challenged in these words, the demon aimed his mace at the Lord and once more loudly roared.
When the Lord saw the mace flying toward Him, He stood firmly where He was and caught it with the same ease as Garuda, the king of birds, would seize a serpent.
His valor thus frustrated, the great demon felt humiliated and was put out of countenance. He was reluctant to take back the mace when it was offered by the Personality of Godhead.
He now took a trident which was as rapacious as a flaming fire and hurled it against the Lord, the enjoyer of all sacrifices, even as one would use penance for a malevolent purpose against a holy brahmana.
The context of the reference given herein regarding Garuda and Indra is this. Once upon a time, Garuda, the carrier of the Lord, snatched away a nectar pot from the hands of the demigods in heaven in order to liberate his mother, Vinata, from the clutches of his stepmother, Kadri, the mother of the serpents. On learning of this, Indra, the King of heaven, hurled his thunderbolt against Garuda. With a view to respect the infallibility of Indra’s weapon, Garuda, though otherwise invincible, being the Lord’s own mount, dropped one of his wings, which was shattered to pieces by the thunderbolt. The inhabitants of higher planets are so sensible that even in the process of fighting they observe the preliminary rules and regulations of gentleness. In this case, Garuda wanted to show respect for Indra; since he knew that Indra’s weapon must destroy something, he offered his wing.
The demon was enraged when his trident was cut to pieces by the discus of the Personality of Godhead. He therefore advanced toward the Lord and, roaring aloud, struck his hard fist against the Lord’s broad chest, which bore the mark of Srivatsa. Then he went out of sight.
Hit in this manner by the demon, O Vidura, the Lord, who had appeared as the first boar, did not feel the least quaking in any part of His body, any more than an elephant would when struck with a wreath of flowers.
The fighting enjoyment of the Supreme Lord with His devotee, who had been converted into a demon, appeared severe enough to bring about the dissolution of the universe. This is the greatness of the Supreme Personality of Godhead; even the wavering of His little finger appears to be a great and very dangerous movement in the eyes of the inhabitants of the universe.
Fierce winds began to blow from all directions, spreading darkness occasioned by dust and hail storms; stones came in volleys from every corner, as if thrown by machine guns.
The luminaries in outer space disappeared due to the sky’s being overcast with masses of clouds, which were accompanied by lightning and thunder. The sky rained pus, hair, blood, stool, urine and bones.
So let’s go further
In this verse the Lord is addressed as Kesava because He killed the demon Kesi in the beginning of creation. Kesava is also a name of Krsna. Krsna is the origin of all incarnations, and it is confirmed in Brahma-samhita that Govinda, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the cause of all causes, exists simultaneously in His different incarnations and expansions. The demon’s attempt to measure the Supreme Personality of Godhead is significant. The demon wanted to embrace Him with his arms, thinking that with his limited arms he could capture the Absolute by material power. He did not know that God is the greatest of the great and the smallest of the small. No one can capture the Supreme Lord or bring Him under his control. But the demoniac person always attempts to measure the length and breadth of the Supreme Lord. By His inconceivable potency the Lord can become the universal form, as explained in Bhagavad-Gita, and at the same time He can remain within the box of His devotees as their worshipable Deity. There are many devotees who keep a statue of the Lord in a small box and carry it with them everywhere; every morning they worship the Lord in the box. The Supreme Lord, Kesava, or the Personality of Godhead, Krsna, is not bound by any measurement of our calculation. He can remain with His devotee in any suitable form, yet He is unapproachable by any amount of demoniac activities.
So at last he just tried to get hold of the Lord and crash Him. But as he went to do that, he found the Lord was standing out of his arms.
The Lord is explained here to be adhoksaja, beyond the reach of all material calculation. Aksaja means “the measurement of our senses,” and adhoksaja means “that which is beyond the measurement of our senses.”
Though struck indifferently by the Lord, the conqueror of all, the demon’s body began to wheel. His eyeballs bulged out of their sockets. His arms and legs broken and the hair on his head scattered, he fell down dead, like a gigantic tree uprooted by the wind.
So finally when the Lord killed him, how did he do that? He just slapped him on the ear with His left hand. “The Lord Adhoksaja slapped him in the root of the ear and as a result of that; Though struck indifferently by the Lord, the conqueror of all”. This demon was the conqueror of all in the universe.
Although he was the conqueror of all in the universe, what happened? A little slap from the Lord, and he just started to wheel and finally he felt on the ground as an uprooted tree.
The process of yoga is very clearly described in this verse of Srimad-Bhagavatam. It is said here that the ultimate end of the yog?s and mystics who perform meditation is to get rid of this material body. Therefore they meditate in secluded places to attain yogic trance. Yoga has to be performed in a secluded place, not in public or in a demonstration on stage, as nowadays practiced by many so-called yogis. Real yoga aims at ridding one of the material body. Yoga practice is not intended to keep the body fit and young. Such advertisements of so-called yoga are not approved by any standard method. Particularly mentioned in this verse is the word yam, or “unto whom,” indicating that meditation should be targeted on the Personality of Godhead. Even if one concentrates his mind on the boar form of the Lord, that is also yoga. As confirmed in Bhagavad-Gita, one who concentrates his mind constantly in meditation upon the Personality of Godhead in one of His many varieties of forms is the first-class yog?, and he can very easily attain trance simply by meditating upon the form of the Lord. If one is able to continue such meditation on the Lord’s form at the time of one’s death, one is liberated from this mortal body and is transferred to the kingdom of God. This opportunity was given to the demon by the Lord, and therefore Brahm? and other demigods were astonished. In other words, the perfection of yoga practice can be attained by a demon also if he is simply kicked by the Lord. So in this verse, it has been pointed out after.
And then today’s verse
Maitreya continued: My dear Vidura, I have explained to you the Personality of Godhead’s coming down as the first boar incarnation and killing in a great fight a demon of unprecedented prowess as if he were just a plaything. This has been narrated by me as I heard it from my predecessor spiritual master.
So Maitreya Rsi narrated this incident to Vidura. So here he is pointing out that this is not that something he just concocted, he heard it from his predecessors, his spiritual master. So in this way the spiritual knowledge is received from the spiritual master. And this is what constitutes the parampara or disciplic succession. The spiritual master imparts the knowledge. What is this knowledge? Knowledge about the Lord and His activities and by hearing these narrations, our faith in the Lord increases. That is why this is actually a big challenge. In the material nature, there is so many stories going on, especially nowadays, all kinds of strange characters are being created Superman, Spiderman, Batman and all kinds of characters are created. And it seems that they are endowed with super natural power. But these are not such stories like Spiderman or Superman. These are not the stories of “Lord of the Rings” or “Harry Potter”. What is the difference? These stories are told by self realized souls. These incidents are told by self realized souls. Let us consider for our case. Where are we getting this information? From Prabhupada’s books. Now what did Prabhupada do?
Did Prabhupada concoct some stories? No. He presented the scriptures as it has been given by the previous acaryas. And then we can see Prabhupada’s character. Prabhupada is a personality who never tolerated any nonsense. He never spent a single moment in frivolous talks. Why such a serious person, who is so wise, so learned why should he present something, if it is not the Absolute truth. That is how we must have our faith established. And it is not only Prabhupada. Who narrated it before Srila Prabhupada, Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur. Look at his character. Before that Bhativinode Thakur, before that Jagannath das Babaji, Baladev Vidhyabhusan, Visvanath Chakravati Thakur, Krsna das Kaviraj, Raghunath das Goswami, Rupa Goswami, Sanatana Goswami, Caitanya Mahaprabhu goes on and on and on, Madhavacarya, Vyasadev. Who is the original narrator of these incidents? Vyasadev And from Vyasadev, we go to Narada, from Narada we go to Brahma and from Brahma who originally narrated these incidents, The Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krsna. So this knowledge is coming from The Supreme Personality of Godhead. That is why we can accept this knowledge without any hesitation. Not only the narration of the Lord’s pastimes, the philosophy, the science behind this topic; that is how we have to develop our conviction. And the more faith we have, the more this knowledge will affect us. Today we are reading just as a story, but as our faith grows, our attachment to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, our love for the Supreme Personality of Godhead will grow. So that is the process.
What is the ultimate purport of all these narrations? The purpose of all these narrations, all these presentations in the scriptures is simply to increase our faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead and depend upon Him. We become so perturbed with a little difficulty, we become so disturbed with little scarcity, we become so agitated with little discomfort, but if we consider that the Supreme Personality of Godhead is there and who is going to take care of us in all respects, that is the only confidence that we have to develop. That he is there and he is going to take care of us in all respects. There is nothing to worry about. So that is how we have to develop in Krsna Consciousness. Development in Krsna Consciousness means development of faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead. We do not have to worry about anything. Krsna will take care. Krsna is giving us so much and and Krsna will continue to give us everything that we need. That is what we have to understand and if some difficulties come, we have to understand that those difficulties are simply there to increase our faith in Krsna. Krsna will put us through difficulties, but Krsna will take us out of the difficulties also if our faith is strong enough; and by doing that, then Krsna will increase our faith.
Where is the question of saving if there is no danger? Right. How can we be saved if we are not in a dangerous situation? If something like Krsna puts us in difficulties. Like say we don’t know how to swim and Krsna puts us into the water and we are about to drawn then Krsna comes and rescue us. From that incident what do we learn? Then we can say Krsna saved us. If we did not fall in the water, if we are not in a dangerous situation, where could there be a question of saving. This is how Krsna puts us through difficulty, and by putting us into difficulty and taking us out of the difficulty, Krsna increases our faith.
But what do we need to have on our part? We have to have faith in Krsna. Krsna, You will save me. And ultimately when Krsna will save you? Krsna will save us from the most dangerous situation. What is the most dangerous situation? Death.So we have to have faith that at that time Krsna is going to save us. He will save us from the cycle of birth and death. So that is the meaning of Krsna Consciousness. But what happen to us? Little difficulty and we forget Krsna. Little difficulty and we start to scream. Oh! Why is it happening to me? Now what shall I do? Now my life has become miserable. Yes your life has become miserable, so depend upon Krsna. Your life is miserable to begin with. So just depend upon Krsna. Depend upon Krsna and everything will be all right. And we may not see Krsna, but we can see Krsna’s devotees. Krsna works through His devotees. Krsna makes arrangement through His devotees. So remain in the association of devotees and you will see how they are going to save you. Krsna acts in the most amazing way. Our business is to depend upon Krsna and He will take care of us in all respects.
Thank you very much. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
Yes Krsna Arcana.
Krsna Arcana: Gurumaharaj, a couple of questions.
First, you explained how devotees are always used in responsible positions by the Lord. The materialistic devotees, the demigods are given responsible ship, although it is said that in the association of the Lord we should be very simple like the gopis. …..Why does not the Lord appoint his pure devotees in the material world because they were to be here the world will be easily delivered.
GM: Krsna is very expert in selecting the candidates. He gets the right candidate for the right job. All right. Some people are expert in management, some individual; but ultimately a devotee accepts everything as Krsna’s mercy. Krsna did not appoint Uddhava to fight the battle of Kuruksetra, Krsna selected Arjuna, because he is the right person. But when it comes to consoling, he selected Uddhava. So in Krsna’s arrangement, everyone is perfectly situated in his respective position. So that is what I have to understand wherever I am that is the perfect situation for me to serve Krsna. That is the devotee’s consideration. Wherever I am that is the perfect situation. Not that I have to become something, not that Uddhava has to become Arjuna to become a devotee. Uddhava is Uddhava as the best devotee; Arjuna is Arjuna as the best devotee; Gopis are gopis as the best devotes, the cowherd boys are cowherd boys as the best devotees. That is their respective position and they are not competing, why I am a cowherd boy why I am not a gopi. That is a mundane consideration, envy. Why is he better than me? But the devotee’s situation is that I am in the perfect situation, wherever I am that is the perfect situation. If I am cooking for Krsna that is the perfect situation, if I am washing the pot for Krsna that is the perfect situation, if I am distributing books for Krsna that is the perfect situation, if I am preaching in the university that is the perfect situation, wherever I am situated that is Krsna’s arrangement. Then if Krsna says: “Please go and wash the pots.” Then we should not say: “Oh, I am a big preacher, why should I wash pots? No. Krsna’s point is whatever is needed for the service go ahead and do it And Krsna will empower us.
Chandra Shekar: Just a small, just a detail, we are reading Varaha’s pastimes, just as in Vaikuntha, Lord’s associates look like Narayan, the question came to my mind what the associates of Lord Varaha look like?
Do they look like boar also?
GM: Yes, if I am not mistaken Prabhupada once mentioned that the Lord in the spiritual sky can have the four arms form and His pastimes form. Like for example, there is a planet of Lord Nrsimhadev where He is half man half lion, but in the same planet, He is also four arms, like maybe you have noticed the 1st canto of Srimad Bhagavatam, the old one, There are different planets of different personalities of Godhead and all of them there have four arms Narayan form. So there He has is his Narayan form also and He also has His lila form.
Chandra Shekar: Regarding Krsna protecting us from death…. A few days ago I witnessed HH Maha Visnu Maharaja’s passing away; it was the first death I ever saw in my life. On one way it was the most profound, the most enriched spiritually, but in another sense it raised a doubt in my heart, with my material vision because I did not see anything extraordinary, I did not see any spirit soul transferred to the spiritual world so it remained a material event to my eyes…
GM: So now just reflect on it . Whose deficiency it is? If you are not able to see His spirit soul going back to Godhead, whose fault it is? Who is lacking? Whose deficiency it is? Did you see any spirit soul? How did u expect to see that spirit soul. But the question is how did he leave his body? Surrounding by devotees, chanting the Holy Name, absolutely peaceful, chanting himself.
Chandra Shekar:…not audible…
GM: Anyway, Krsna is all merciful. Prabhupada said that to Go back to Godhead, you have to become 100% pure. Then somebody asked but Prabhupda what happen if one is not 100% pure. He is 90%. Prabhupada said Krsna will cover the 10%.
Chandra Shekar: I do not doubt Maharaja’s purity at all…
GM: So 20%, 30%. The thing is on our part we try. But Krsna will give whatever we are lacking. Like I say for example, a child is learning to walk, doesn’t the mother give the helping hand? or the mother completely indifferent about that, Ok, you learn how to walk. Is that the mother’s attitude? No. So similarly in our devotional service also, in our spiritual life, Krsna is always there to give us a helping hand and we have to have that faith. Yes, like let us consider that one, if death comes now, how are we going to face it? Most of us will be completely baffle, but because of this training, because of this endeavor, so many years in practicing Krsna Consciousness, we have developed some faith. Immediately we may not remember Krsna but as the difficulties begin to overpower us. At some point we are going to give up our own endeavor and depend upon Krsna. And it is not going to be easy for the soul to leave the body, which has been in this body for so many years. We got used to the habits of this body for so many years. But the thing is like Krsna is there. If we depend upon Krsna, Krsna will save us. A simple example, we are devotees, if we get a little hurt, what happen? Don’t you scream? Should we think, Oh, he is a devotee why does he scream? Should that be our attitude? But the devotee on his part when he is hurt, he may scream but the next moment he will think Oh, Krsna! Oh this is Krsna’s mercy. Krsna is reminding me that I am not this body. This is how his consciousness will work and that is the reason why training, practicing the process is so important.
Ok. Hare Krsna. Yes, any question?
Angad: God selected the devotees who are obedient. ….Sometimes it is difficult to find the right person…… So how to select properly? But they are qualified….
GM: Leave it up to the selection committee. And a simple answer to that will be ok one is not 100% committed, 100% obedient, but if it is a choice between 45%, 50% and 60% obedient then who will be the choice? You got my point? Someone is 45% committed, surrendered, one is 50% surrendered and one is 60% surrendered, who is the more competent? Who is the more suitable candidate?
Angad: One who is the more qualified to do the job.
GM: Yes that is true, but all three are equally competent in doing the job.
GM: Right. That is why I meant by leaving it up to the selected committee. The person who is appointing he will select according to the ability of the person. But on the part of the Lord, He will appoint Like say for example the demigods, they are not 100% surrender to Krsna, they are not pure devotees, demigods are mixed devotees; they surrender to Krsna but they have desire for sense gratification, that is why they are demigods otherwise they would have been vrajabasis, they would have been promoted to Vrndavan, but relatively since they are surrendered to Krsna, obedient to Him that is why He gave them the appointment. They have their desire, they want and Krsna fulfill their desires.
Now how many percent surrender you are? For which job that is the first question? Anyway become a good devotee. Good devotee means surrender to Krsna.
Angad: Some devotees do not follow the representative of the Lord… not audible
GM: Well, are they chanting Hare Krsna? They are chanting Hare Krsna Are they following the instructions of Prabhupada? Yes. So they are devotees. They are not thinking that, mayavadis mean that impersonal, they don’t believe in the form of the Lord. These devotees are they worshipping the deities? So, they are devotees. They may not be 100% pure devotees but they are devotees. Mayavadis are offenders of the lotus feet of the Lord.
Q: I have a question, maybe I will get chastised?
GM: Maybe I have to chastise you before that?
Q: It is very difficult to go back to Godhead we have to take part in the Lord’s pastimes?
GM: So devotees’ attitude is millions of life time. It does not matter. Right. When I will go back to Godhead like…you know the story of the cobbler?
What did the cobbler say?
A: The cobbler said after many lifetimes you will go back to Godhead…
GM: No. What did Narada Muni tell to the cobbler?
Where was the cobbler seating? Under a tamarind tree. What did Narada Muni say? As many leaves are there in this tree, that many times you have to take birth. And what did the cobbler say? He started to dance. Oh, some day, the Lord is going to give His mercy. Then what happen? All the leaves felt. Yes. So by the divine arrangement of the Lord anything is possible. So do you want to go back to Godhead or do you want to serve Krsna?
GM: So what is the worry? (laughs)
Yes Jaya Dharma
Q: May I take birth as a worm in the stool as far I am in the house of a vaisnava
Q: In the spiritual world,. everything is living even the pillow. The food staff are also living?
GM: Yes, they are also conscious, and they say it is so nice to be in the mouth of a devotee. You see like the world of consciousness is beyond us to comprehend. From a material point of view we won’t be able to understand what it is like the world of consciousness.
Q: We hear so many stories, so many material stories they become popular for a little while and people become gods for a little time but these stories for time immemorial they have not become stale. They are still nectarian and nice to hear. That is the proof.
GM: That is the difference between fiction and Krsna Conscious lilas. Fiction and Reality.
Q: It is said in the material world 8.400.000 species of life, do we a precise number in the spiritual world?
GM: 8.400.000 is there but they are not in that calculation, this is according to gunas and karma. There is no consideration of gunas and karma, there everyone is engaged according Krsna’s desire. Krsna’s desires are unlimited that is why the forms are also unlimited. Don’t speculate like that. Now I have to chastise you.
Laugh… Just accept what Prabhupada has said in his books, just accept. Mental speculation is not going to take you anywhere.
Yes Yamuna Priya.
Q: Thank you Guriumaharaj for speaking so nicely about faith. According
To how much faith we have in Krsna, Krsna will protect us and difficult situations will increase our faith. Some devotees understand the point but while going through the pain it seems to have some forgetfulness. So how can one devotee respond to the situation of the other devotee?
GM: By reminding them about Krsna and the importance of depending upon Krsna. That is the ultimate solution to all our difficulties, trials and tribulations.
Maybe you can repeat the last part.
Yamuna Priya: Devotees are in distress, and in the depth of their distress they forget that.
GM: That is why association of devotees is so important. On one’s own, one may forget but if he is surrounded by devotees then they will remind him of Krsna because they themselves know the importance of depending upon Krsna. When one approaches a devotee at the time of difficulty, what will the devotee say? The devotee will naturally give some help but at the same time he will remind him about Krsna. Or when it comes to a point when no material solutions is there, like say for example at the time of death. Initially somebody is sick, you may call the doctor, you may make some arrangement for the treatment and all, but when all fails? Then what? I mean, You may say, the doctors in Ujjain are not good enough let’s get a doctor from Indore, the doctor in Indore are not good enough let’s transfer him to Mumbai, the Mumbai situation is not good enough take him to London, London is not good enough take him to Orlando but then what? At some point all the material possibilities will be exhausted. Then What? That is why not taking the ultimate consideration to begin with. We are not saying do not take material measures but behind all that it should be there that ultimately it is up to Krsna. So let us depend upon Krsna. Sometimes it happens devotees come to me with total despair Oh doctors are not working, none of the medical treatment are working. So what can I say at that time, I just remind them depend upon Krsna, accept these difficulties as Krsna’s arrangement and you think this situation is difficult, at the time of death it is going to be millions times more difficult than this situation, remember that. And how will you remember Krsna if you cannot remember Krsna now. So depend upon Krsna, Remember Krsna now, then everything will be all right.
Yamuna Priya: So we just remind them that
GM: Often the devotees, I am sure most devotees have some amazing experiences, being hunting by ghosts. You get attacked by ghosts You did Then you just called out Krsna and then what happen?
Yamuna Priya: Someone told me say it.
GM: And when you said it what happened ? Then what. So that is the proof. You just the name of Krsna and the difficulties will be over. And that is how we have to face death. Difficulty will be there.
From Mukunda Mala Stotra, mantra 33
kantah varodhana-vidhau smaranam kutas te
At the time King Kulasekhara is praying “At the time of death, when my throat will be choked up with mucus, bile, and air” how difficult it will be at that time, I will be trying to breathe and I won’t be able to breathe. How I will remember you at that time? That is how difficult it is going to be. But if we remember Krsna if we really take shelter of Krsna, Krsna is Just waiting at that time. Auto many just when it is difficult at and you say I try and you say Krsna, the dream is over and you will wake up in Vrndavan.
Q: Would you like to tell us anything related to the placing of Maha Visnu Maharaj in Samadhi?
GM: Oh, you won’t be here tomorrow. Ok. You see when I was in Kolkata 3 or 4 days back, when was that ? Ekadasi was on 26th so on 25th Braja Hari called and told me that Maha Visnu Maharaja’s health condition was deteriorating and he might leave any moment. So Radhanath Maharaj and I were together at that time. So Radhanath Maharaj called up Madhavendra Prabhu, the in charge of the Bhaktivedanta Hospital, Madhavendra Prabhu also confirmed the condition of Maharaj, and then Madhavendra Prabhu told some devotees that Maharaj and I would like to talk to Maharaj if possible, we were told that Maharaj was very conscious although he is not speaking, but he was responding. So we spoke and I told Maharaj, I would very much like to see him and I would go the next morning to Mumbai; at that time Vraja Hari Prabhu was actually going to Bhaktivedanta Hospital and on the way he got the message that Maharaj left his body, so he phoned me and told me that Maharaj left his body; therefore I thought if Maharaj stays or leaves, I will go to Mumbai the next day, when I told Radhanath Maharaj , Maharaj felt that also he will come. So we made the arrangement, I just called up my travel agent and he made the arrangement. So, Braja Hari Prabhu, by the time, reached the Hospital and he called me. He was telling that these devotees were wondering if somebody could come from Mayapur to help them for Maharaja’s Samadhi. I told Vraja Hari Prabhu I was going the next day so I will help and from Mumbai I will try to take Sevatuli Prabhu with me to assist us. Braja Hari Prabhu knew that I put Prabhupada in Samadhi, I mean, Tamal Krsna and I actually put Prabhupada in Samadhi so I had some idea and then the devotees started to communicate with me. Vraja Hari Prabhu conveyed it to them. So I was commutating with them I told them what to do. So they felt that Maharaj left on the 25th and they decided to put him in Samadhi on the 27th because many devotees wanted to come from different parts to have Maharaja’s last darshan. So that gave us some time. So, on the 26th as you know, from Bombay airport we went straight to Bhaktivedanta Hospital. They decided to take Maharaj to Nassik on the 26th afternoon, we went there at about 12.30, then they decided to move Maharaj at about 3 to 3.30 and Maharaj wanted to have his Samadhi in Nassik, because Maharaj actually grew up, his early days were spent in Nassik, he may have been born also in Nassik, I don’t remember, there he knows many people and many people knew him and I was a little surprised when I saw the location it was not in Nassik it was about 16 kms out of outskirt of Nassik, quite far actually, it took us one hour to go there and there is nothing, it is an empty field, empty land, 6 acres of land and I heard Maharaj bought that land 40 years back, anyway so as you know I came back after seeing Maharaj, they took the body and it was decided that we will go the next morning and next morning, after mangala arati we left for Nassik. They had some difficulty, as you know they have to dig the pit and the place that they selected after they dug 2 feet they found rocks there, so they needed to have a JCB to dig it. So next morning they had a JCB, but then JCB could not go too deep because they found solid rocks, hard rocks, so but then when we were driving they actually found, Yudhisthira Maharaj, disciple of HH Radhanath Maharaj, making that arrangement, digging that place and all that, he was in constant touch with me while we were driving, at one point he called and said that they found a place where they could go 8 feet deep, the pit is dug about 8 feet deep, 6 feet by 6 feet and 8 feet deep. Maharaj had a house in Nassik so his body was first taken to that house, so we went there and it was arranged that Maharaja’s body will be taken to the location from there. There is a temple, actually some of disciple of Radhanath Maharaj built a temple there in Nassik, simple structure very nice temple so Maharaja’s body was taken first to the temple and he got the darshan of the Deities and then they offered aratik and after that we went to the location, by the time it was quite late like 12.30 in the afternoon. The original plan was that we will start the ceremony by 9.30 that is why we left so early at 5. Originally we thought leaving at 4 o’clock to be there before 9 o’clock so when they told us that they found rocks and they won’t get a JCB before 8 o’clock, then we decided to go a little late and we decided to attend mangala aratik and around 5.30 we left from there so it was already 12.30 when we reached there because he took a lot of time. Taking the ISKCON Temple in Nassik we spent at least one and half hour there, I mean in total. The place as I said was quite far, the traffic was bad and in the mean time, originally I thought that we would go there and then come back to Bombay and take a flight yesterday morning to come to Ujjain. But then I phoned Parasurama, I had found out that there is a flight from Nassik to Bombay and someone told me that there is a flight in the evening so I thought if I take a flight then probably I can be in Bombay airport to catch the evening flight to Indore so I called Parasurama and Parasurama arranged the flight and we took the flight of 5.30 from Nassik to Bombay and then at 7.30 from Bombay to Indore. It is a Go Air Flight. So we just finished the Samadhi at 3.30. He took us about 3 hours. You know like for Samadhi, you bathed him, I got some of his intimate disciples to conduct, generally it is said that a sannyasi’s samadhi ceremony should be conducted by sannyasis but here I thought if the disciples will cherish it more and will appreciate it more so I suggest that let his disciples to conduct the thing and I was guiding them. So all along I was guiding them and they were also very nice, they did everything according to whatever I told them. Maharaja’s body was bathed, we took Ganga water and water from Haridwar Kumba Mela and like that we took Holy waters and Maharaja’s body was bathed then dressed and then we put tilaka on his body, I wrote the mantras, some mantras had to be written on his body with gopichandan, and then after that they offered flowers, seniors devotees offered garlands. Actually they had few hundred garlands; they had about 500 to 600 hundred devotees and forty to forty five devotees came from Surat. Just a coincidence, they were just on a pilgrimage in Nassik at that time when Maharaja’s body was brought there, so they were there and many devotees came from different parts of the world, actually from Bombay, Dwarka, from all these places devotees came. Maharaja’s family members were also there. Maharaja’s son was there, he came from London but he was there for about three weeks back, so in this way, we put his body in samadhi and after the samadhi, there were supposed to have glorification, but I could not wait for the glorification because to catch the flight at 5.30 I had to leave at 3.30; so just when the samadhi was almost done I took leave and I came to Nassik the flight was on time, and the flight from Bombay was unfortunately quite late, instead of 7.30, the flight actually took off at 9.10, it arrived in Indore at 10pm. By the time I came here it was about 11 to 11.15pm. And then I met you all. Yes it was very nice. Since we are talking about Maharaj, Let briefly discuss about Him. Actually from Google there was a biography of Maharaj. So Radha Piyari put it in the BCS Istagosthi, Maharaja’s life story. Maharaja was born in 1920; he is a Gujarati; so he was brought up in a Krsna Conscious environment. Maharaj mentioned, he must have mentioned himself that His mother brought him up in a Krsna conscious way. So his mother used to teach him whenever he got a new cloth he must offer it first to Krsna before wearing it. But he didn’t know why? His mother asked him to do that, he did it, but he did not have any understanding why it was necessary. Only later on when he came across Srila Prabhupada, he found out why everything first have to be offered to Krsna, because everything must be received as Krsna’s Prasad. Maharaj did his master in English and he was proficient in 4, 5 different languages: English, Hindi, Gujarati, Marathi and he used to know Urdu also. Then he left India and settled in Eden for some time. Then from there he went to London. I actually met Maharaj in 1985 for the first time. From the very beginning we had a very nice relationship, he was very affectionate. Whenever I used to go London, those days I used to spend a lot of time in Soho Street and Maharaj used to be in Soho Street. He had an apartment near Soho Street, around that time I met Priyavrata also. Priyavrata also used to come to Soho Street everyday, every morning. He was the manager of an Art Gallery in London, near Central London, near Soho Street. He used to come to Soho Street Temple, attend the Bhagavatam class.
Gurumaharaj: “You used to come for the Deities greetings.”
Priyavrata: I used to come at 5.30.
Gurumaharaj: ” You used to come at 5.30 every morning! Very good samskara! Laughs. So Priyavrata also used to come. And because he used to go and get dressed for work, he used to be dressed in suit and tie; and he used to serve everybody. After the class, prasadam he used to serve, and after serving he used to take Prasad and then go to office. He had a nice laugh! We used to call him Ghoti, it is actually a French cut. Now Maharaj was so nice, he was so much older than us, but you know in ISKCON the sannyasis got a special status so whenever I used to be there I used to give class I used to notice Maharaj every morning during the class he used to be there. He was very jovial, very warm, very kind. Those days he did not give classes?
Those days he never used to give classes, because he used to come to the temple, attend the programs, then he used to go back to his apartment.
So I used to ask him, Maharaj, what do you do the all day? He said I read Prabhupada’s books. So for years, I think for good five to six years.
Priyavrata: “He was retired.”
Priyavrata: ” He had nothing to do, so he was in the apartment. He was slightly handicapped. He was disabled that is why the government…
Gurumaharaj: “What was his disability?”
Priyavrata: “I think physically, I think legs, legs’ problems. He was given a disable car. He could park wherever and whenever
Gurumaharaj: ” Oh, I see. But he was not that ,disabled actually.
Priyavrata: ” Everybody could see he was limping slightly.
Gurumaharaj: ” Yes, that is true. He was a very, very avid reader. Those days, you know like, I mean I used to take him just as one of the congregation devotee, but he was very jovial and very friendly. Then he took initiation, he was initiated before. He was initiated first by Jaya Tirtha. Here is a very interesting thing. He met Srila Prabhupada in 1973, Prabhupada wanted to give him initiation, Prabhupada even told him he should become a sannyasi, but he did not take initiation from Prabhupada at that time thinking that he was quite ready, he was not prepared and then Prabhupada left and he used to lament later on. And I used to tell him that don’t worry you have accepted Srila Prabhupada, and you are following Srila Prabhupada, you are Srila Prabhupada’s disciple. I also treated him like Prabhupada’s disciple. Then he started to travel and preach. At some point, he took sannyasa. “Which year did he take syannasa?”
Priyavrata: ” In 1991.”
Gurumaharaj: “No maybe earlier was that ? In 1991, he took sannyasa Priyavrata: “I left in 1990.”
Gurumaharaj: ” Yes he was not a sanyasi at this time. Right. That is true.
So in 1991 he took sannyasa from Sivarama Maharaj, he started to travel and I remember I invited him to come to Radhadesh. Those days I was the GBC of Belgium. In Belgium we have a very beautiful temple, one hour away from Brussels, it is a beautiful castle called Chateau de Petite Somme. So I invited Maharaj to come and his classes were very wonderful, very learned, at the same time very jovial, he used to make a lot of jokes about brahmacaris, the brahmacaris’s difficulties and how bramacaris’s resolution becomes weak. One incident I remember, He used to give some hilarious examples. I will tell you this one. There was a very rich man in Bagdad. So one day a friend came to his house so the rich man wanted to treat his friend in a very grant way so he sent his servant to the market and told him to get the best of the things to treat his friend. So his servant went to the market and after a while his servant came back running to him. What happened? Where are the items I wanted you to buy, he said when I was at the market there I saw death standing behind one shop and I became so afraid. He came back running and his hair was standing in end, his body was shivering, he said please tell me what you should I do, then he said you do one thing, you take the fastest horse and go to Basle, so the servant immediately got the fastest horse from the stable, set it up and road for Basle, so the master became little curious, and he thought let me go and see death in the market place, so he went and found death standing behind the shop. So he asked death why you scared my servant in this way, the poor guy I sent him to buy something without buying anything he just ran to me, why did you do that to him. Death said no, I did not want to scare him actually, but I was a little surprised to see him here in Bagdad because I had an appointment with him in Basle. He used to tell so many hilarious stories.
His Holiness Maha Visnu Swami Maharaj ki.Jaya!
Maha Visnu Goswami Maharaj ki! Jaya!
Gaura Prema nande Haribol!
Srila Prabhupada ki Jaya!
Transcription : Her Grace Archana Dasi
Editing : Her Grace Hemavati Dasi
Audio-version : click here